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CO-ED Accommodation

FSTO

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CO-ED Accommodation

A little bit of a whine here (okay, compared to the folks living in dry tents in the desert, we don't have a leg to stand on.)

Deployed to Bahrain, we are all living in 2 or 3 bedroom apartments. Each bedroom has its own ensuite, television, desk and door can be locked. We have one female (Cpl) who gets a whole apartment to herself while more senior officers are sharing 2 bedroom apartments.

In light of the recent accusations of sexual misconduct in the CAF, I can see why this is so.

But can we see a future where this will not be an issue and two folks regardless of gender can share an apartment while deployed?
 

daftandbarmy

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CO-ED Accommodation

A little bit of a whine here (okay, compared to the folks living in dry tents in the desert, we don't have a leg to stand on.)

Deployed to Bahrain, we are all living in 2 or 3 bedroom apartments. Each bedroom has its own ensuite, television, desk and door can be locked. We have one female (Cpl) who gets a whole apartment to herself while more senior officers are sharing 2 bedroom apartments.

In light of the recent accusations of sexual misconduct in the CAF, I can see why this is so.

But can we see a future where this will not be an issue and two folks regardless of gender can share an apartment while deployed?

Based on findings about co-ed living in the Norwegian Army, segregated accommodation can even make things worse:


Unisex rooms in the army take emphasis off gender​

A new report on gender equality in the Norwegian Army says that the girls feel less sexually harassed by the boys when they share rooms.​


But instead of finding an increased focus on gender and sexuality, the researchers concluded that the unisex rooms had a degenderising effect.

“To them there was nothing strange about the unisex rooms. They had entered a common mode where gender stereotypes had disappeared, or at least they were less obvious. The uniform was also helping as it was more difficult to see the difference between boys and girls,” says Lilleaas.

“There is no gender in the army, there is only green”, said one of the interviewees in the research."





U.S. Military, Take Note: Norway’s Unisex Army Dorm Rooms Are Working​

Forcing female and male soldiers to sleep in the same room may sound like an odd way to improve the military’s notoriously poor gender relations, but the Norwegian Ministry of Defense has found success with a pilot program.

According to a new report, coed living arrangements actually facilitate “degenderization,” which helps to de-emphasize gender clichés and improve team morale. “There is no gender in the army. There is only green,” said one of the subjects in the study, “The Army: The Vanguard, Rear Guard and Battlefield of Equality.”


 

kev994

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When I lived in a large tent in Kandahar I’m pretty sure they were coed, each room was separated from the other by a piece of tarp hanging from the ceiling.
 

dimsum

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Deployed to Bahrain, we are all living in 2 or 3 bedroom apartments. Each bedroom has its own ensuite, television, desk and door can be locked. We have one female (Cpl) who gets a whole apartment to herself while more senior officers are sharing 2 bedroom apartments.

In light of the recent accusations of sexual misconduct in the CAF, I can see why this is so.

But can we see a future where this will not be an issue and two folks regardless of gender can share an apartment while deployed?
So the only common area is a living room (and maybe kitchen)? Having the lockable bedroom (with ensuite) door should be enough for privacy, no?

Is that accommodation setup (women getting an entire apartment) just for Canadians or is it like that for everyone?
 

Oldgateboatdriver

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No, it's in the middle of the back, not on the neck.

But I wouldn't want to get on the wrong side of that lady: Do you see the legs and arm muscles!!!
 

FSTO

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So the only common area is a living room (and maybe kitchen)? Having the lockable bedroom (with ensuite) door should be enough for privacy, no?

Is that accommodation setup (women getting an entire apartment) just for Canadians or is it like that for everyone?
Each nation here decides how it wants to do things. The Danes (2) each have their own apartments. I don't really know about the rest.
 

Kilted

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I remember when co-ed accommodations were fairly common, pre-Op Honour. Never really thought too much about it untill I worked with the Americans. I remember one of them being terrified that there was going to be a female sleeping in a tent with about 60 people in it. A couple other Americans actually thought that the Canadian Forces as a whole had a Starship Troopers style shower arrangement.

I remember the atmosphere in co-ed accommodations was fairly relaxed, I feel like it was easier to work with women that way (at least from a logistical point of view).

I suppose that there are a few different ways to look at it. In some ways I think that women are somewhat excluded when they are sleeping elsewhere.
 

stoker dave

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I was at RMC around the time 'lady cadets' were first enrolled. That was in the early 1980s.
I served onboard HMC Ships with 'mixed gender' crews. That was in the late 1980s/early 1990s.

Both of those circumstances might be considered 'co-ed'.

At those times there was some difficulty in adjusting the culture. I am frankly surprised this is still an issue.
 

daftandbarmy

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I was at RMC around the time 'lady cadets' were first enrolled. That was in the early 1980s.
I served onboard HMC Ships with 'mixed gender' crews. That was in the late 1980s/early 1990s.

Both of those circumstances might be considered 'co-ed'.

At those times there was some difficulty in adjusting the culture. I am frankly surprised this is still an issue.

Meanwhile, in the Infantry :)

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PuckChaser

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So a couple things stuck out at me:

1. Is she the only Canadian female officer in the TF? If not, are the others in 2 bdrm apts by themselves? If other female officers aren't sharing apts, you may have a point about preferential treatment.

2. This is Bahrain. In an Arab country they may be significantly less accepting of a female living with males not from her family. So in the sense of going along to get along, she gets her own apt.

3. "more senior officers are sharing 2 bedroom apartments". It's hard to read tone in text statements but it really comes off to me as a pretty entitled comment to make, especially if we're talking about a female Slt getting her own Apt and 2 Lt(N) or LCdrs complaining about having to share. I guess more context is needed here if you can provide.
 

rmc_wannabe

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No one knows the complete story here, like what the Cpl's take is on it; is she comfortable being in shared accommodations? Was this something that was decided on without her input? Was this a directive that came down from higher (CJOC j1, GBA+ Advisor, etc.).

Honestly, I have slept in a classroom with 7 other people (both genders) on a 6 month tour to free up more comfortable billets (turning 2 person rooms into single rooms) to staff officers. If I had a small violin, I'd be playing it for you.
 

FSTO

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So a couple things stuck out at me:

1. Is she the only Canadian female officer in the TF? If not, are the others in 2 bdrm apts by themselves? If other female officers aren't sharing apts, you may have a point about preferential treatment.

2. This is Bahrain. In an Arab country they may be significantly less accepting of a female living with males not from her family. So in the sense of going along to get along, she gets her own apt.

3. "more senior officers are sharing 2 bedroom apartments". It's hard to read tone in text statements but it really comes off to me as a pretty entitled comment to make, especially if we're talking about a female Slt getting her own Apt and 2 Lt(N) or LCdrs complaining about having to share. I guess more context is needed here if you can provide.
I'm going to be a bit of an asshole here, but did you read the ******* post?
 

SupersonicMax

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What would a complete appartement to yourself bring that a room in an appartement doesn’t? Issues sleeping?
 

PuckChaser

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I'm going to be a bit of an asshole here, but did you read the ******* post?
Considering my post was about the same word length as yours, yes I read the post. If you came here looking for confirmation bias that you should be getting your own apartment, you left out the details that could lead any reasonable person to that conclusion.

Instead of swearing, maybe be an adult and use your words to articulate yourself.
 

FSTO

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Considering my post was about the same word length as yours, yes I read the post. If you came here looking for confirmation bias that you should be getting your own apartment, you left out the details that could lead any reasonable person to that conclusion.

Instead of swearing, maybe be an adult and use your words to articulate yourself.
Not going to get in a discussion about reading comprehension. Right at the start I said it was a whine and that compared to other folks deployed in the region we have it very, very good here.

The young lady in question is a Corporal not a commissioned officer.

Ack on the norms of the country we are in, but the saying among the Saudi's that visit here is "Allah is blind in Bahrain" so things are very liberal here.

I was gauging the response to the idea that men and women can share an apartment while deployed.
 
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