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Canada's New Defence Minister

The Bread Guy

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Oldgateboatdriver said:
....I would arrange for the said NCO a nice private session with CWO West The Minister ....
>:D
 

Strike

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Oh yes.  That's the problem with social media, is that people say things about others and never have to face the consequences.  Imagine the culprit meeting the subject of the comments face to face.  I would LOVE to see how he would react in that case.  Probably a serious case of 'cat got his tongue.'

>:D
 

cphansen

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NO definitely not the Minister.  His role is to keep the department straight. 

He should definitely not have to deal with an individual who attacked him. 

His subordinates should take care of discipline issues, which this definitely is.  Can you imagine the publicity attendant upon the minister dealing with a subordinate. 

I can just imagine the subordinate claiming it was a personal issue between the two of them and the minister was using his position to pick on him. Neither the minister or the CAF need the sort of nonsense this could devolve to.

Let CWO West or whoever is the responsible authority deal with this, and let him provide the necessary counselling. The end result of this should be a soldier who understands what the CAF's policy is and a sincere letter of apology to the Minister.

I don't post often but this seems to be going off the rails, right into the latrine, and at this time of year when we pause to consider the sacrifices that have been made for us by so many veterans.
 

opcougar

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The Hydro one guy did it face to face didn't it? i.e. his stupid comment at Shauna Hunt from City Tv

Strike said:
Oh yes.  That's the problem with social media, is that people say things about others and never have to face the consequences.  Imagine the culprit meeting the subject of the comments face to face.  I would LOVE to see how he would react in that case.  Probably a serious case of 'cat got his tongue.'

>:D
 

Jarnhamar

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I feel sorry for the new MND.  By all accounts he appears to have been a great officer and leader while in uniform. (did some research)

Unfortunately it seems like he's being turned into this months ice bucket challenge/rainbow profile picture/omg cecil the lion. The comments from people going gaga over him like he's this week's fad are obnoxious. I'll be glad when people move on to next week's thing.
 

Strike

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SherH2A said:
I don't post often but this seems to be going off the rails, right into the latrine, and at this time of year when we pause to consider the sacrifices that have been made for us by so many veterans.

I'd say it's pretty safe to say that most of us, as much as we'd like to see the minister confront this guy face to face, are smart enough to know it's not going to happen.

::)
 

little jim

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Some people just don't learn. Found the comment below on the CBC site entitled the MND is a bada&& and why not to fear the Islamic State. (I am posting this not to start yet another reg/res thread but rather just to info there are idiots out there). I have no clue how to link the comments section but as a staff trained officer can cut n'paste with the best of them.

BEGIN QUOTE
TORONTO SHADOW
@Mark Valdock

An actual soldier you say Mark. Well not really, want to know some things about the new Minister?

a. he broke Canadian Forces regulations by running for Political Office while still employed as a member of the CF. A law clearly known to every military member;

b. while running for Office his website portrayed him as a full time member of the CF while in reality he was a Reservist. Yes his service is appreciated and he did step up to deploy three times, but the difference in commitment between a Regular Force member & Reservist is vast. Make no mistake, the difference is known to the Minister and that's why he didn't list himself as a Reservist but tried to paint himself as a full-time soldier. His campaign managers also tried to sell him as a high ranking Officer, a Lieutenant Colonel, again, he's a Reservist Lieutenant Colonel (LCol) , huge difference;

c. his Order of Military Merit Medal (OMM) was played up. Every NCO in the CF knows this is a "gimme" medal handed to most Senior level Officers when one Officer simply writes up another Officer, and if he's lucky, he gets the medal. OMM medals and Member of Military Merit medals pale in comparison to medals of courage, valour, & bravery.

While I'm certain Mr. Sajjan is a good guy and I appreciate his service, I see a lot of deliberate half truths in the way he sold himself to the public. Mr. Sajjan was a cop for 11 years & is now 44 years old. Meaning he did very little time in the CF & rose very quick through the ranks to LCol. How you ask??/ Because he was a Reservist and the comparison is not the same. Trust me, the public may not know the difference but amongst the Regular force everyone knows there's a big difference between the commitment and sacrifice of the Regular Force and the "Mo-Litia".« less

END QUOTE

Great quote - slams the MND, honours and awards system, reserves and the regs in one step.  (Note this is sarcasm, I would love it if those in the know could find the author and see if he is serving. Would make it better if he used a DND computer..)
 

Eye In The Sky

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I like to use the words of a great retired RSM I had the privilege of serving under to speak to the "Reg/Res" debate.  Taken from an Armour Bulletin from back in the day.  Red box mine to highlight most important part (IMO).
 

The Bread Guy

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little jim said:
....  His campaign managers also tried to sell him as a high ranking Officer, a Lieutenant Colonel, again, he's a Reservist Lieutenant Colonel (LCol) , huge difference; ....
Ah, the old "s/he's only a MILITIA (insert rank here) ...."  It only takes a few idiots in a huge crowd to keep that train steamed & chugging.

little jim said:
(Note this is sarcasm, I would love it if those in the know could find the author and see if he is serving. Would make it better if he used a DND computer..)
That would be funny.

Eye In The Sky said:
I like to use the words of a great retired RSM I had the privilege of serving under to speak to the "Reg/Res" debate.  Taken from an Armour Bulletin from back in the day.  Red box mine to highlight most important part (IMO).
Short, sweet but hugely relevant - thanks for sharing that piece.
 

Eaglelord17

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opcougar said:
The Hydro one guy did it face to face didn't it? i.e. his stupid comment at Shauna Hunt from City Tv

/Tangent
The Hydro one guy never actually said the comment your accusing him of, if your going to say someone did something please verify it is actually correct. All he did was defend the comment someone else made which is two different things entirely.

/Tangent over
 

George Wallace

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Eaglelord17 said:
/Tangent
The Hydro one guy never actually said the comment your accusing him of, if your going to say someone did something please verify it is actually correct. All he did was defend the comment someone else made which is two different things entirely.

/Tangent over

Semantics.

In defending the statement, he was agreeing to it, and just as guilty for rewording what was said.  Whether he made the original statement or not, he was defending it; all on camera.


 

captloadie

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Imagine that, racism rearing its ugly head in Valcartier again. I'm sure this isn't the only individual there who has been openly saying these things, just the only one dumb enough to post it online.
 

Oldgateboatdriver

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Sure! Go ahead Captloadie. Tar every Quebecer with the same brush and piss on them. Your own comment is not racist at all!

And of course, there was no racism and no "white supremacists" in the Airborne, nor is there any racism in any of the English Canadian units outside of Quebec. They are all  angels.

Until you can make such demonstration, I suggest you learn to shut your mouth.
 

captloadie

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Umm, dial it back a bit. I was very specific to Valcartier, not the entire belle province. And the reason being is that base has a very recent history of CAF members belonging to known supremist groups and openly sharing their beliefs on the base.

And you are right, there are racists everywhere, not arguing that point. But when one particular area tends keep getting national attention, maybe its time to do something about it.

 

Oldgateboatdriver

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If that is what you meant, you expressed yourself very poorly.

Your reference to Valcartier is not specific to saying "because it is Valcartier" but rather because it is at Valcartier, which any reasonable human being then interpret as a reference to the people there in particular, which everyone knows to be mostly French Canadians (or Quebecers, whichever you prefer).

Now, if you know something specific about some people at Valcartier, then report it through the proper channel to authorities so it can be dealt with appropriately. The last thing we need in Canada is another military scandal.

If you don't know anything specific and are just extrapolating and mouthing off because there was another event some months (actually I think it was more like a year) ago, then you don't know what you are talking about and your comment becomes tarring of all French Canadians there; and you are doing that in a public forum known to attract journalists, and in a specific thread they are almost certainly going to watch.

To rephrase the old joke: "never, ever, ever generalize".
 
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jollyjacktar

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To be fair to captloadie, OGBD, my last tour in the sandbox was Roto 7.  I trained and deployed with the folks from Valcartier.  I am not surprised as well that "someone" from there may have said something and I would also not be surprised if there was more than one person who shared this point of view. 

That being said, however, I would not be surprised if "someone else" from another base in this country shared this point of view.  Racism is everywhere, sadly.
 

The Bread Guy

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jollyjacktar said:
I would not be surprised if "someone else" from another base in this country shared this point of view.  Racism is everywhere, sadly.
Agreed 120%.
Oldgateboatdriver said:
To rephrase the old joke: "never, ever, ever generalize".
You're right, too.  I don't think it's racist, though, wondering "whazzup with some folks @ Valcartier?", though, based on this and this in the past couple of weeks, though - the same way I'd say "whazzup in Shilo?" when I see this.
 

Oldgateboatdriver

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Well unfortunately, Captloadie's comment was not expressed as sadness to find such racism there or anywhere in the CAF, like yours is Jollyjacktar. It was more along the lines that "Hey! I'm not surprised knowing what a hot bed of racism that place is" type of comment.

Anyway, I think we should go back to topic: The Minister of  Defence himself.

Saw the out take on CBC yesterday where the reporter interviewing him in his office (was it Wendy?) tried to get him to commit on CF participation in the plan to bring 25000 refugee and the timing of withdrawal of the CF-18's before the details have been worked out. I thought he deported himself very well. I particularly liked the comments on ISIS not being a direct threat to Canada that cannot be handled by our security services.
 
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jollyjacktar

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I believe that he is the best man for the job that was available and I am confident he won't leave me disappointed.
 

blackberet17

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Oldgateboatdriver said:
Well unfortunately, Captloadie's comment was not expressed as sadness to find such racism there or anywhere in the CAF, like yours is Jollyjacktar. It was more along the lines that "Hey! I'm not surprised knowing what a hot bed of racism that place is" type of comment.

Anyway, I think we should go back to topic: The Minister of  Defence himself.

Saw the out take on CBC yesterday where the reporter interviewing him in his office (was it Wendy?) tried to get him to commit on CF participation in the plan to bring 25000 refugee and the timing of withdrawal of the CF-18's before the details have been worked out. I thought he deported himself very well. I particularly liked the comments on ISIS not being a direct threat to Canada that cannot be handled by our security services.

OGBD, I almost jumped on your use of "deported", until I hauled out the thesaurus. It may also mean "comported", so well played.
 
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