Topic: Shuttle Run Calculations

[Manticure]

OK, I just did a practice shuttle run using the mp3 provided by PMedMoe. I made it to the part where the guy says "Level 4... 5" and kinda "gave up" meaning I got extremely tired and stopped running, although if it was a real deal I would probably pull up to maybe "Level 4.. 8". So would the "Level 4.. 5" mean that I've completed 4.5 levels? Would that be the same as the Canadian military though? If so, it's a bit better than I was expecting. I've been running every second day for the last few weeks and I usually do 1k in 6mins, 1.5k in 9:30 mins, and the most I was ever able to run non-stop was 2k in about 13 mins. But anyways now I can be sure that I can at least meet the threshold standard for the Warrior preparation company, unless I missed something?
Can someone here confirm that that mp3 is the same or very close to the Canadian shuttle run level system?
Thanks.

[Occam]

Can someone here confirm that that mp3 is the same or very close to the Canadian shuttle run level system?
Thanks.

Here is a link to the CF shuttle run:

http://rapidshare.com/files/361799397/A_Full_beep_test.mp3.html  (file can only be downloaded 10 times before deletion, so get it while it's there)

[Manticure]

Allright thanks, I'll have to do this one instead tomorrow and check again. One more thing I am unclear about though: the guy in this mp3 said in the beginning "when the test begins, run as long as possible at a standartized pace". That kind of contradicts with the shuttle run rules doesn't it? What exactly does he mean by saying run as long as possible?

[Kratos]

My guess would be that it's basically reminding you to pace yourself.

I've done the beep test once or twice before and the few legs are sooooo slow. You really have to try your best not to go too fast.

[Manticure]

Well apparently the australian version is the same or very close to the canadian version of the test, as I was only able to achieve the 4.5 stage in both of them. I think in the next month or so that I have till basic, I will be able to improve up to 5 or maybe 5.5 and then I guess I'll have to go to WPC for a while. But in any case, thanks a lot for the sound file, it's very helpful, perhaps someone should post it in a sticky thread somewhere. I've also uploaded it to another website which doesn't seem to have download restrictions.
http://kiwi6.com/file?id=q6osp2tvk5

[HavocSteve]

Well if you go to a normal gym, its the length of the outsides. so if you can run 20m and pace it, you should be able to reach level 4 if your somewhat active. It's really only a sprint once you get to level 4 and then you gotta dig deep to reach the level 6.

[Manticure]

Well if you go to a normal gym, its the length of the outsides. so if you can run 20m and pace it, you should be able to reach level 4 if your somewhat active. It's really only a sprint once you get to level 4 and then you gotta dig deep to reach the level 6.

Well I simply measured a distance on a sidewalk. There is no gyms anywhere where I live.

[Occam]

Well if you go to a normal gym, its the length of the outsides. so if you can run 20m and pace it, you should be able to reach level 4 if your somewhat active. It's really only a sprint once you get to level 4 and then you gotta dig deep to reach the level 6.

What's a "normal gym"?

Once you join, you'll find there are big gyms and small gyms.  Measure 20m, and that's your course.

If you're 21 years old, you should not have to "dig deep" to reach level 6.  If you are, you'd better be training harder in preparation for basic.

[Manticure]

In my case I doubt that training harder would make it better for me. I run every second day and still my legs never stop being sore. I might have damaged some muscles there, because even I tried taking two days of break in a row and still I could feel my legs hurt a little when I start running.

[Occam]

In my case I doubt that training harder would make it better for me. I run every second day and still my legs never stop being sore. I might have damaged some muscles there, because even I tried taking two days of break in a row and still I could feel my legs hurt a little when I start running.

If that's the case, then you are likely going to experience difficulty with BMQ.  I am no expert when it comes to fitness, but you would be wise to consult with someone who is an expert in order to better prepare yourself so that BMQ is not a huge leap in effort when you arrive there.  Breaks are few and far between during BMQ.  Talk with someone who can get you from where you are, to where you need to be - without injuring yourself.

[Manticure]

Well it's still over a month till my basic training and I will most likely still have to go to that warrior prep company, which will definitely help me a lot.

[PMedMoe]

Well it's still over a month till my basic training and I will most likely still have to go to that warrior prep company, which will definitely help me a lot.

If you go in with the attitude that you are going to Warrior platoon, you most definitely will go to Warrior platoon.  Why plan on failing before you even get there?  The CF isn't supposed to get you in shape, you're supposed to be in shape before you join.  How much notice have you had?  I notice you've been posting here since Sep.  Did you just start working out now?

Looking through your post history, I see a lot of "what happens if I fail" queries.  Stop overthinking everything, calm down, take a deep breath and continue your workouts.  The 20 MSR is not necessarily the be-all and end-all.  Training on endurance (running longer as opposed to faster) will also assist you. 

Your profile doesn't say how old you are, but I'm guessing fairly young.  I reached level 5 on my PT test four years ago and I was over 40.  I tend to agree with Occam, go see someone about your legs or you might be in for an injury on BMQ and that will almost definitely be a ticket out the door.

[HavocSteve]

What's a "normal gym"?

Once you join, you'll find there are big gyms and small gyms.  Measure 20m, and that's your course.

If you're 21 years old, you should not have to "dig deep" to reach level 6.  If you are, you'd better be training harder in preparation for basic.

Well normal gym as in school type. Most of them are of avg. size. As for me being 21.. yes I know I shouldn't have to dig deep in order to reach level 6, but I also put on over 100pounds in the last couple of years due to my body growing. So I put on some extra flab =\ but that's why I'm working on it and I haven't even received a call yet.

[Manticure]

If you go in with the attitude that you are going to Warrior platoon, you most definitely will go to Warrior platoon.  Why plan on failing before you even get there?  The CF isn't supposed to get you in shape, you're supposed to be in shape before you join.  How much notice have you had?  I notice you've been posting here since Sep.  Did you just start working out now?

Looking through your post history, I see a lot of "what happens if I fail" queries.  Stop overthinking everything, calm down, take a deep breath and continue your workouts.  The 20 MSR is not necessarily the be-all and end-all.  Training on endurance (running longer as opposed to faster) will also assist you. 

Your profile doesn't say how old you are, but I'm guessing fairly young.  I reached level 5 on my PT test four years ago and I was over 40.  I tend to agree with Occam, go see someone about your legs or you might be in for an injury on BMQ and that will almost definitely be a ticket out the door.

I just went to a doctor about my calves pains. She said basically because of lack of stretching and sudden increase in running activity my muscles got overstrained or something along those lines. She said I can still continue running but with good stretching this time and at a reduced frequency, only 2 times a week or so, and it will take up to 3-5 weeks for full recovery.

[PMedMoe]

Well, I'm pretty sure you'll be running more than twice a week at BMQ.

[Manticure]

Well, I'm pretty sure you'll be running more than twice a week at BMQ.

My point is that all I need is to make sure my injury heals by then.

[fischer10]

Alright, well some seem to be kind of confused (may have been cleared up) but I am going to post up the levels and distances for the Bleep/Beep/Shuttle run test i downloaded (which I found on this forum but can't remember the place).

1 - has 7 runs = 140m at 1:12
2 - has 8 runs = 160m at 2:14
3 - has 8 runs = 160m at 3:14
4 - has 9 runs = 180m at 4:19
5 - has 9 runs = 180m at 5:21
6 - has 10 runs = 200m at 6:26
7 - has 10 runs = 200m at 7:29
8 - has 11 runs = 220m at 8:36
9 - has 11 runs = 220m at 9:39
10 - has 12 runs = 240m at 10:42
11 - has 12 runs = 240m at 11:44
12 - has 13 runs = 260m at 12:45

It goes on up until level 21 which has 16 runs (lvl 21,16) but for most level 12 should be lots. At level ~9,5 = 2.5Km for this test which means you would be able to run it in 9:04. I've been a runner for years, I'm 5'11" and weigh 155lbs and I can run level 12 when pushed. I regularly do level 10,5 (why i chose here i have no clue lol) but my goal is to run 11,1 "easily" by the time i get the call to go (hoping i will be in BMQ this April). Anyway, enough about me. As for those having troubles meeting the minimum, keep pushing it - do two Beep/Bleep/Shuttle runs a day. If your legs are sore then do a warm up (I do 5 minutes running level 5 speed from the beep test and then do leg exercises and a SMALL stretch). Exercises can be wall jumps, Marching A's (VERY VERY VERY IMPORTANT FOR FORM DO THEM!!!!), butt kicks, foot sweeps, and high kicks. Squats and other leg strengthening exercises don't hurt either, so youtube this stuff and go at it. FORM is important when running people, learn to run correctly and it saves massive amounts of energy (may get you an extra level!). Another thing - once your past level 12-13 (not sure) all the runs stay at 20m in ~4 seconds until last level.

Well if you go to a normal gym, its the length of the outsides. so if you can run 20m and pace it, you should be able to reach level 4 if your somewhat active. It's really only a sprint once you get to level 4 and then you gotta dig deep to reach the level 6.

Whether your male or female I would aim for at least level 9 before going (even if it means making yourself feel like death after running it). Also after you finish running yourself into the ground don't lay down or stop moving, bad! Keep walking around and keep your head above your chest (this was said in another thread as well)

It's not really the same as just stating a distance and speed (responding to the original post).

The biggest challenge with the test is that you are stopping and accelerating so much, which is far harder.

That's why people who can typically run for an hour before passing out can only do this test for 10 minutes.

This is true from what I have experienced since i started running the test, although the more you do it the easier it gets, and it doesn't take long before you are running level 8 or 9.

So for the shuttle run.. Is it 11mins or so for the 2.4km run or is it say 11mins or so for like 1km then 11mins or so for the other 1km then like 4 mins of the .4km thats left...

Im not a runner nor a jogger really lol mostly a skateboarder guy or bicycle. so im a lil worried about the outcome of this... id much rather have the step test =\

You have to run the full 2.4Km in under 13:47 (min:sec) (when i last looked, could have changed). If you have to take 26 minutes (from the way i read your post) to run it, you are in deep trouble . Bicycling is good for leg strength (if you run it in a hard gear...better be!) but bicycling doesn't help your running at all really, it uses different muscles for the most part, so to get better at running, you have to run... As for the step test, I don't know what that is and am not looking it up at the moment (lol).

Shuttle Run - Grip Test - Push-Ups - Sit-Ups.

There's a warm up at the beginning, not really any breaks other than the wait to get the grip test done.

Yay? So I am going to be dog tired after running my butt off for 10-12 minutes and then go do all the muscular! Sounds great, guess I will practice doing push-ups and such after running now. As for a warm up, you don't really need one people, once you start running the beep test it starts slow enough that it will gradually warm you up.

Hope some of this helped some people, if not feel free to correct and give me trouble as I am new here =).

P.S. If anyone wants the Beep test mp3 I have message me and I can email it to you (I don't think I can upload to the site?)

Anyway, good luck running and start to enjoy it, from what i hear we get to do lots once we are in

[HavocSteve]

From the levels you posted fisher10.... does the 7 runs and then 8 runs mean you run back and forth that many times before you progress to another level?

So in total for the level 6 minimum you have already ran back and forth 51 times?

I know I'm not really a runner at all.. but I've been doing the step test just to get my cardio and leg strength up before I go out for some runs. I'm not worried about the 13km forced march because I can walk all day long and earlier in the summer I was walking the 5km back and forth to the store with 50lbs of weight in a backpack.. Just the running part scares me a little.

[fischer10]

From the levels you posted fisher10.... does the 7 runs and then 8 runs mean you run back and forth that many times before you progress to another level?

So in total for the level 6 minimum you have already ran back and forth 51 times?

I know I'm not really a runner at all.. but I've been doing the step test just to get my cardio and leg strength up before I go out for some runs. I'm not worried about the 13km forced march because I can walk all day long and earlier in the summer I was walking the 5km back and forth to the store with 50lbs of weight in a backpack.. Just the running part scares me a little.

Yup, you have it correct. You should download the Beep test and run it. Here is the one I use: http://www.runtheplanet.com/trainingracing/training/bleeptest.asp (instructions to download are on the page ...if you don't have an mp3 play may be good to get one...cheap one like 30 bucks or something). I don't do any leg strengthening at the moment (probably should though lol) but I find it is my lungs having trouble not my heart or legs. Any more questions ask away or personal message!

[HavocSteve]

Ahh ok figured as much.. one last question..

Tip on breathing? When I breath through my nose it seems like only the one side works and the other one is like not working? lol Been that way since I've been little.. like one is clogged or something. So really, I'm a mouth breather.. Just take big breathes then little ones I guess.

Maybe I should see a nose and throat specialist?

[fischer10]

Ahh ok figured as much.. one last question..

Tip on breathing? When I breath through my nose it seems like only the one side works and the other one is like not working? lol Been that way since I've been little.. like one is clogged or something. So really, I'm a mouth breather.. Just take big breathes then little ones I guess.

Maybe I should see a nose and throat specialist?

Have you been in some fights? or broke your nose? Because thats most likely what it is, just deformed catilage blocking the airway, not much one can do about that, just use your mouth to breath, what I do.

As for my breathing I don't like breathing through my nose (use to get nose bleeds easily due to my nose being dry) so when I breath I use my mouth to exhale and inhale. Try and focus on breathing out (Paracowboy suggested this, as where I got it from) because your body will naturally inhale the amount it needs (for the most part). Form is running is key, learning how to run will help your breathing. Few tips:

1) Do marching A's.
2) Hold your abdomen/stomach area in tight.
    - This helps keep cramping to a minimum, and if you do get a crap suck it in even tighter and it should eventually fade (so I find)
    - Also makes your chest expand to allow longs to fill. Get into the habit of doing this. Good breathing exercise is to sit/stand with back straight and breath in fully (expanding chest not stomach) and then continue to try and breath in for as long as possible, then exhale as slow as possible. Can be done anywhere you want, I also do it after running my butt into the ground (don't know if its good for you, but helps me calm down faster and stretches the lungs good).
2) Try to regulate your breathing and find where your comfortable breathing amount is (mine is 2 breaths/20m up till level 8, then I have to breathe harder)
4) Sit-ups/Plank/Bicycle etc on for core strengthening better your core, the less you will breath with your stomach.
5) Use your Diaphragm to blow out air (look up what and where it is if you don't overly understand).
6) To keep my mouth from drying out I noticed I have my tongue sorta sideways in my mouth.
    - This causes the air coming in to kind of slow and go right down my wind pipe as to flooding my mouth before if goes down. (Tongue is against my left front and the tooth next to it twisted so the top of my tongue faces right...best I cant explain haha).
7) Swallow saliva and do not spit it out!
    - Also swallowing every once and a while even when your mouth doesn't feel very "dry". But by the time you hit higher levels a lot of this goes out the window as your winded.
    - At that point just run with "explosive" bursts usually on one breath (100m racers only take one breath whole time they run form what I have read) as your muscles can keep moving without oxygen for a fair amount of time.
Run again, and again and again
    - Your breathing will get better the more you run =)

You have many "energy stores" you don't tie into when you don't push yourself, you'll find you hit a "wall" push through it and it will level out. I find at level 8-9 I have a wall and then again at mid-level 10. After I push through the last one I can make level 12. Some people say you need time to rest and regain, but running every day you can do I find it doesn't hinder anything. Just don't push yourself to like heart failure or something if you are unsure of your ability to run. One last thing is after running, walk around and drink water...Don't sit or stop moving, causes more lactic acid to build up (feel this happening shake your legs and keep moving ..). You could try holding your breath each 20m once you start breathing fast, may help I do this in higher levels.

If anymore Q's ask away. (goal to reach maybe level 10,5 - I think you get an exemption and only have to do the testing every 2 years or something? read it on the site somewhere).

Have fun running

[HavocSteve]

Don't recall breaking my nose and I've only been in one fight my whole life lol.. other then that it's been downhill bike crashes and skateboarding accidents which tend to really hurt. Only broke my foot a couple of years ago, but the 2nd day I was walking around without crutches cuz I couldn't get around fast enough lol. Not really worried about getting tired but once the rain stops here in Oshawa, I'll definitely try to get my breathing under control. Hopefully that will do the trick. Thanks for the posts

[fischer10]

Don't recall breaking my nose and I've only been in one fight my whole life lol.. other then that it's been downhill bike crashes and skateboarding accidents which tend to really hurt. Only broke my foot a couple of years ago, but the 2nd day I was walking around without crutches cuz I couldn't get around fast enough lol. Not really worried about getting tired but once the rain stops here in Oshawa, I'll definitely try to get my breathing under control. Hopefully that will do the trick. Thanks for the posts

Well, most likely what it is from haha. Also running in the rain is fun (adds a few lbs to you making it a good workout). Unless its cold, then not so good idea xD. Good luck!

[PMedMoe]

You may have a deviated septum which can be fixed with surgery, although, having surgery (and the likelihood of actually getting surgery scheduled) before you go to BMQ is not the greatest idea.

[HavocSteve]

You may have a deviated septum which can be fixed with surgery, although, having surgery (and the likelihood of actually getting surgery scheduled) before you go to BMQ is not the greatest idea.

Well it took my sister over a year for her Nose and Throat specialist to call and for booking an appointment to get her tonsils removed. Not really a huge deal I don't think with the Nose.. Just have to practice breathing calm instead of gasping ahaha.