Author Topic: Lead, Please, Prime Minister  (Read 6144 times)

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Offline The Ruxted Group

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Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« on: June 28, 2007, 08:11:39 »
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Lead, Please, Prime Minister

Prime Minister Harper is quoted as saying that he wants consensus from Canadians before he will ask Parliament to extend the current Afghan mission beyond Feb 2009.

The Ruxted Group applauds the PM for both insisting that Parliament – the House of Commons – agree to major military operations, and asking Canadians themselves to consider the merits of this mission and guide their elected representatives. 

Regardless of the common sense and fundamental democratic ideals satisfied by this initiative what is lacking is true leadership.  In saying “I would hope the view of Canadians is not simply to abandon Afghanistan” without actively persuading the people of Canada that his preferred course of action is right, good and proper the Prime Minister has effectively abdicated his responsibility to lead and along with it, his ability to convince Canadians that their troops are in Afghanistan are fighting the good fight for the right reasons.
 
The Prime Minister needs to bring the choices before us into stark relief.  The issue is not just the mission in Afghanistan, though that is the public face of this crisis.  It is also an articulation of a national vision and Canada's place in a rapidly polarizing world.  This government has talked at length about how this country used to punch above its weight, and has complained just as loudly about how previous Liberal governments have squandered Canada's reputation on the world stage, yet here is the Prime Minister calling vaguely for a consensus without articulating his ideas for a rational, moral and achievable alternative to the ideological and political divides that face the nation today.

The Prime Minister needs to ‘sell’ Canada’s emerging lead role and the current mission to Canadians, especially to Québecers.  This is a theme which The Ruxted Group has visited over and over and over again.  In 2006, when he persuaded a reluctant parliament to approve an extension of the mission until early 2009, Prime Minister Harper appeared interested only in embarrassing the Liberal opposition.   He offered Canadians little in the way of solid reasons ‘why’ – rather he threatened a weak and divided opposition with a snap election.  That tactic, although it served the purpose of whipping the opposition into line, was never good enough for Canadians and only distracted from the very real, important and noble reasons that their troops are killing and being killed in Afghanistan; the healing, reconstruction, and development desired by all cannot proceed without the sacrifices inherent in providing security.

We are extremely disappointed (but not all that surprised) at the fact that Prime Minister Harper is doing exactly what he accuses his opponents of doing: playing political games, and seeking to wring the maximum partisan political advantage out of the situation in Afghanistan.  It is time for Prime Minister Harper to lead the country.  As we said at the start, the issue is not just the mission in Afghanistan it is about Canada’s role in the world – the leadership role Prime Minister Harper says is his government’s objective.  Canada needs a coherent foreign policy and Canadians need direct, honest political leadership during these hard times, we do not need more of the same on both these fronts, which is exactly what Mr Harper offered up this week.

By articulating a clear vision of Canada's goals in Afghanistan and how we intend to operate in the future, free of political posturing and spin, Prime Minister Harper may develop the consensus among Canadians he desires, and provide us with a vision for Canada in the 21st century world.  There is an old military maxim: Lead, follow or get out of the way! 

Lead, please, Prime Minister.

Offline Cdn Blackshirt

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2007, 08:50:42 »
I think Harper is a bright guy between his ears.

That being said, I think he has amongst the most incompetent communications strategies I have seen anywhere, demonstrated by an entity, at any time.


Matthew.   
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Offline E.R. Campbell [5]

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2007, 09:54:24 »
I think Harper is a bright guy between his ears.

That being said, I think he has amongst the most incompetent communications strategies I have seen anywhere, demonstrated by an entity, at any time.


Matthew.   

But, on this and other issues, is he leading the country?  Or is he following the polls?

If he's not leading then does it matter if he's smart?


----------
P.S.  As I have said before, I'm a paid up, card carrying Conservative; that doesn't mean I check my brains and opinions at the door.
If all mankind minus one were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.
John Stuart Mill, On Liberty (1859)

Offline KevinB

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #3 on: June 28, 2007, 10:06:56 »
I must say I fully agree with Ruxted -- one of the big complains with Mr Dithers, was that he would never make a decision with out firmly sounding out public opinion -- that not leadership.  I expected a lot more from the Conservative gov't -- despite being a Minority -- they NEED to lead -- the PM should be willing to fall on his sword over this issue, since we have been expending a great deal of BLOOD and money to get the Afghan gov't to where it is now.  Failing this, it will show (well me for one, a paid up card carrying member of the CPC, and no doubt others) that the value we expected from them, when we cats our votes for them, where all in naught.

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Offline Smode

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #4 on: June 28, 2007, 12:14:26 »
There comes to be a difference between leading a country properly and following the polls. I think so far Harper is doing a great job compared to our Previous leader. A leader to me is someone who will make choices for the country without asking the canadian people. We elected Harper to be our leader, we elected him to make decisions for us. THats the reason hes the leader of the Tories. Now , I Can respect him a lot for wanting to speak with parliament and see the polls on certain issues. This shows he is willing to hear the Canadian People and their issues.  :cdn:
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Offline Kiwi99

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #5 on: June 28, 2007, 12:31:38 »
It is sad to read the news these days, waht with all the political crap about pulling out of Afgahnistan in 2009.  Popular opinion is against the war, so what.  The way that this new policy on Afghanistan is playing out is going to kill the Canadian Army.  Who wants to be part of an organisation that is'nt allowed to carry out it's primary purpose.  The people of Canada do not want us to go to war, nor do the opposition parties.  I guess that means we no longer have to go on exercise, as we have nothing to train for.  Not allowed to fight a war, why train for warfighting?  This country and Government should be ashamed of themselves.  A complete and utter emabarresment!!!
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Offline Boxkicker

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #6 on: June 28, 2007, 12:55:37 »
 Lets face it the PM is damned if he does and damned if he does not. The media has crucified him for everything. Lets face fact he has paid the price for the policies of the Liberals. Why was it that this was never an issue when those bunch of crooks were in power or the so called detainee issue.
  Since day one the media of this country has been trying to get the conseratives un-elected. 

 
Peace is our desire. Honor and sacrifice our calling.

Offline E.R. Campbell [5]

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #7 on: June 28, 2007, 13:00:42 »
Lets face it the PM is damned if he does and damned if he does not. The media has crucified him for everything. Lets face fact he has paid the price for the policies of the Liberals. Why was it that this was never an issue when those bunch of crooks were in power or the so called detainee issue.
  Since day one the media of this country has been trying to get the conseratives un-elected. 


 

Why, then didn't he enunciate new, clear policies?

Remember, now, I'm a Conservative, but where are the non-Liberal policies?  Where is the difference on foreign and defence policy between Harper and Martin?  Martin was buying new kit - maybe not exactly the same new kit as the Tories are buying but much needed new kit, all the same.  Martin started a foreign policy review.  If Harper is being crucified for Liberal policies it's because he kept applying them.
If all mankind minus one were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.
John Stuart Mill, On Liberty (1859)

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #8 on: June 28, 2007, 13:14:10 »
Oh so true.

But the public wants us to become, once again, those traditional "Peacekeepers" wearing the baby blue berets with no risk of offending anyone's sensibilities; least of all those who'd sit back here in their warm, cozy little lives keeping their hands clean and in total denial of the fact that "Peacekeeping" is NOT riskless and politics-free.

How soon the Canadian public forgets that those idyllic Peacekeeping missions have cost the lives of 116 Canadian soldiers and 3 civilian employees. Those fallen were honoured with the very same repatriation ceremonies as our fallen from Afghanistan. Perhaps the public just missed it because the MSM didn't claw over each other to get in and film those solemn ceremonies for broadcast to the masses, but I guess that may have tarnished that good Peaceful Baby Blue Canadian International Halo image they all like to claim as their own.

Wake up Canada!!


Learn your history, and most of all ... be damn proud of it. You have some pretty fine soldiers acting as your ambassadors to the world both in Peacetime and in time of War, as has always been the case.

« Last Edit: June 28, 2007, 13:19:02 by ArmyVern »
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Offline Boxkicker

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #9 on: June 28, 2007, 13:59:37 »
Why, then didn't he enunciate new, clear policies?

Remember, now, I'm a Conservative, but where are the non-Liberal policies?  Where is the difference on foreign and defence policy between Harper and Martin?  Martin was buying new kit - maybe not exactly the same new kit as the Tories are buying but much needed new kit, all the same.  Martin started a foreign policy review.  If Harper is being crucified for Liberal policies it's because he kept applying them.

 Pretty simple on some things to me, when it comes to new policies if it ain't broke don't fix it. Why meddle with something if it works.   

  When it comes to some of the new kit that martin was going to buy it would have first been studied to death in committee. Instead we have a PM that says we need it now. I do not believe that we would have ever seen any of that new kit the Liberals said they would look at.
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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #10 on: June 28, 2007, 14:30:46 »
Pretty simple on some things to me, when it comes to new policies if it ain't broke don't fix it. Why meddle with something if it works.   

  When it comes to some of the new kit that martin was going to buy it would have first been studied to death in committee. Instead we have a PM that says we need it now. I do not believe that we would have ever seen any of that new kit the Liberals said they would look at.

There were problems with the policies ... that's why Harper is in power with his fellow Conservatives now.

Yep, he fast-tracked operational kit that we needed desperately ... we are fighting and dying after all; it's the least they could do. Now, as Ruxted has said below ... when are they going to start TALKING about and defending this mission to the Canadian public?? The sound of their silence is catching up with them...just look at the polls.

Good, bad, pretty, or ugly, the public likes to be informed of what exactly is going on when Canadian Soldiers are dying ... when they hear nothing from the elected Leader of Canada on that face ... they believe what they are told, usually quite willingly, by the MSM and the opposition because no-one is stepping up to tell them the difference.

That stepping-up is usually called leadership.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2007, 14:33:17 by ArmyVern »
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Offline HighlandFusilier [5]

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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #11 on: June 28, 2007, 14:45:06 »
If Harper really believes in the mission, he'd risk his political career and make this the #1 issue on the political agenda and risk an election over it.

I think Harper is gradually trying to change the mind of the Canadians, but the blowback from certain stupid things the Conservatives have said, and Harper's fumbling of how to actually talk to the Canadians about this subject while the Libs and the NDP have fired rhetoric that appeases the avg joe Canadian and now, I think unless radical change of tactics for Conservatives happen, we are going to lose public support for the mission.

Personally, I'm in favour putting the Afghan mission to a public referendum. If Canadians do not have the balls to face up to all those principles that Canada supposedly stand for, I'd rather have it done publically so that every joe Canadian must realize what is happening.

And announce to the world too.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2007, 14:49:57 by HighlandFusilier »
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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #12 on: June 28, 2007, 15:14:07 »
There were problems with the policies ... that's why Harper is in power with his fellow Conservatives now.


  I am not saying that were not problems with policies. But how many policies needed to be sorted out and how many did not. In the department we work for it has been one problem after another.
  First it was that the head shed had to get us new kit, aircraft, armor some big expensive new pieces of desperately needed equipment. The problems that we have faced have been all created by the Liberals. But the PM and current MND have paid the price for it. It is the face of hypocrisy at the utmost that all the current problems being faced bye this government was caused by the Liberals, when it comes to the military.   
  It bothers me that for the media it was all well and good when it was the Liberals putting the shaft to us,it never created any sort of political fire storm. Even after the MND would say well this was done under the previous government, but we will fix it. the media still made the Liberals and NDP,come off smelling like a rose.
 i do agree that there has been bad communication though coming from the government, when it comes to the mission. I would love for the media to actually pick up on some of the fuzzy friendly things being done as well as the government. That might change a few minds.   
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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #13 on: June 29, 2007, 07:49:16 »
With all respect, I can't agree with the editorial. Harper is a leader - - period. He is also smart enough to know that to continue to be a leader in this country he can't ignore the reality of the significant numbers of left-leaning idiot voters who don't understand the military, its purpose, and history. For good or ill that will require a vote on the mission. We do live in a democracy.

Tell me what other PM in recent times has accomplished as much as Harper, in as short a time and with a minority government. He's a balls forward leader and has pushed the other parties in the House of Commons to the wall. Be careful when challenging his character as a leader. 

CHIMO
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Re: Lead, Please, Prime Minister
« Reply #14 on: June 29, 2007, 08:13:32 »
While I like Harper - it does not mean I have to go thru life with blinders on.  Sit back and think that since Afghan support was intially of 75%, heck even pre Iraq war we had a 55% approval for going there.  The issue is the PM's officer has not properly lead the public into the hows and why's of the war.
  And dont go blaming left leaning people -- you think ANY one of them really would want Afghan to go back under the Taliban?  The left is one of the foremost supporters of womens, gays and every other minority groups rights -- the fact is most are too stupid to have an opinion and beleive rhetoric from the OPFOR Leaders in Parliament -- Canada needs to get on the ball, and sell the war.
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